This is the closest those sidebar ads ever got to sexy male armor standard.
Hell, we can even see the Oni’s underpants! Now give both of those gentlemen sultry poses and flirty expressions and we’re be on good way for male empowerment.
I wanted to congratulate ASTA for not going with the trite “sex sells” advertising, but of course that’s what I found upon further googling:
By no way the worst we’ve seen and there are better female designs the game is promoted with, so let’s be cautiously optimistic?
~Ozzie
This is the closest those sidebar ads ever got to sexy male armor standard.
Hell, we can even see the Oni’s underpants! Now give both of those gentlemen sultry poses and flirty expressions and we’re be on good way for male empowerment.
I wanted to congratulate ASTA for not going with the trite “sex sells” advertising, but of course that’s what I found upon further googling:
By no way the worst we’ve seen and there are better female designs the game is promoted with, so let’s be cautiously optimistic?
~Ozzie
@millatheshieldmaiden submitted:
Has this been submitted yet?
No, no it had not. I have to say, I really find it amusing that when you have a controlled marketplace like the iStore or Android Shop, people always seem to interpret this as a challenge and try to claim they’re pushing the limit of… what people aren’t there looking for (because it’s not sold there).
Can you imagine this mentality applied in other ways? “The most violent comic in romance anthology!” “The most text heavy movie on DVD!”
The lack of faith this conveys in the quality of their RPG as an RPG is simply breathtaking.
– wincenworks
Stop insulting our intelligence by pretending there’s a good reason for naked women in videogames
Stop insulting our intelligence by pretending there’s a good reason for naked women in videogames
For the most part, I do like the article – particularly as it’s not just Cortana’s wardrobe that’s worrying. However it does (in it’s final paragraph) make a critical error in that it assumes that somehow the marketing and promotions for a game are inherently different and separate from the creation of the game itself.
As wonderful as it would be for us to live in a world where creative teams are insulated from Creepy Marketing Guy by armies of private security equipped with electric cattle prods and canisters of mace, this simply isn’t reality. Especially not in the case of auteur productions where the person overseeing the marketing campaign is the one overseeing the game development.
Despite there being no rational reason to believe that sex actually sells, we still see plenty of examples where female characters are given ridiculous outfits in the belief it will sell a few thousand more units. Sometimes it’s in complete contradiction to the context of the product and sometimes it’s from a range of outright horrifying concepts.
It’s gotten to the extent where many of them have now pushed franchises and their own styles into a point where they have no idea how to make them less hostile to women without losing their branding. Thus enforcing the idea that women should only play games made specifically for women (which will not be treated seriously by the industry, despite sales and the industry stealing ideas from them left, right and center).
Games are a business and that, unfortunately, means that marketing will never be completely separated from production. Instead of living in denial, we should focus on pushing games to use the right kind of marketing.
– wincenworks
I also take issue with how, in its final paragraphs, the article implies that ridiculous excuses are provoked by critique which asks about consistency in female character design. And that critics should be free to criticize but also refrain from bringing extra attention to the controversies… However that’s supposed to work.
I’m glad the article says that the game developers should be honest about intentions behind their designs. And that their sexy lady justifications insult the audience’s intelligence. Still, it would be overall better analysis of the problem without taking the “let the games speak for themselves" angle.
~Ozzie
Stop insulting our intelligence by pretending there’s a good reason for naked women in videogames
Stop insulting our intelligence by pretending there’s a good reason for naked women in videogames
For the most part, I do like the article – particularly as it’s not just Cortana’s wardrobe that’s worrying. However it does (in it’s final paragraph) make a critical error in that it assumes that somehow the marketing and promotions for a game are inherently different and separate from the creation of the game itself.
As wonderful as it would be for us to live in a world where creative teams are insulated from Creepy Marketing Guy by armies of private security equipped with electric cattle prods and canisters of mace, this simply isn’t reality. Especially not in the case of auteur productions where the person overseeing the marketing campaign is the one overseeing the game development.
Despite there being no rational reason to believe that sex actually sells, we still see plenty of examples where female characters are given ridiculous outfits in the belief it will sell a few thousand more units. Sometimes it’s in complete contradiction to the context of the product and sometimes it’s from a range of outright horrifying concepts.
It’s gotten to the extent where many of them have now pushed franchises and their own styles into a point where they have no idea how to make them less hostile to women without losing their branding. Thus enforcing the idea that women should only play games made specifically for women (which will not be treated seriously by the industry, despite sales and the industry stealing ideas from them left, right and center).
Games are a business and that, unfortunately, means that marketing will never be completely separated from production. Instead of living in denial, we should focus on pushing games to use the right kind of marketing.
– wincenworks
I also take issue with how, in its final paragraphs, the article implies that ridiculous excuses are provoked by critique which asks about consistency in female character design. And that critics should be free to criticize but also refrain from bringing extra attention to the controversies… However that’s supposed to work.
I’m glad the article says that the game developers should be honest about intentions behind their designs. And that their sexy lady justifications insult the audience’s intelligence. Still, it would be overall better analysis of the problem without taking the “let the games speak for themselves" angle.
~Ozzie
Guy that (supposedly) worked on a mobile game said they’d first tried not to use sex appeal. Tried some inoffensive DLC & got lukewarm response. Then they caved & tried selling things that “sexed up” the game. Supposedly they gained more male gamers (& their revenue) than they lost from girls leaving. QUESTION: Are there good visual examples of warrior women that are genuinely sexy (to teens into girls, theoretically) without being demeaning? Can we have “sex appeal” revenue w.out offensiveness?
The problem with crediting “sexing up” the game with increase in sales is that it assumes sex was the only avenue of generating interest – a theory that doesn’t hold up when you consider that some of the biggest selling game types (flight simulators, first person shooters, side scrolling platformers) often don’t include any sexual angle at all.
Back in 1970, Marvel comics experimented with putting Conan the Barbarian in comic format. After the first few issues sales began to decline and the writer, Roy Thomas (who loved Conan), went to Stan Lee (who was indifferent to Conan) for advice. Stan looked at the covers and the sales, and told them to shift away from putting animals on the covers and instead use more humanoid monsters.
They followed Stan’s advice: Sales went up again and the comic continued for twenty-three years. However you don’t see many people campaigning that “Humanoid monsters sell!“ then trying to fit them into all marketing regardless of product or target market. (And sex obviously wasn’t selling Conan, they had bikini damsels after all)
Conan the Barbarian, in his loincloth and flexing his muscles, looked like a poor man’s Tarzan (which had been the popular comic fifty years ago) when battling animals – but when battling humanoid monsters he looked like a more mature fantasy narrative that was new and unique in comics at the time.
The only narrative that sexing/male gazing up a game really provides is “This game is made to cater to the fantasy of straight men.” So if swapping out your old narrative for this one increases interest and sales dramatically – then your old narrative must have been pretty boring.
There have been numerous warrior women in video games over the years. Most of them have been under marketed, relegated to sidelines, ignored or otherwise mishandled due to general fear that they weren’t meeting the “make straight men feel important” factor that modern markets cling to as their sacred idol.
- Cate Archer is essentially a light-hearted, distaff James Bond in the No One Lives Forever franchise dresses in the attire of a fashionable lady in the 60s. Often sexy but out of character for the production. Monolith would later try to replace her with “Contract J.A.C.K.” and have since lost the paperwork so nobody knows who owns the intellectual property.
- Faith Connors from Mirror’s Edge has the fitness and style we’d expect of a free running rebel and certainly looks good on the cover.
- Mona Sax was, until the end sequence of Max Payne 2, a badass assassin who liked her tight tops but also pants and a jacket to side her gun (Mona starred in more or less equal space with Max on the cover of Max Payne 2, but is barely even mentioned in Max Payne 3).
- Aveline de Grandpré dresses in badass leather when assassinating and very becoming gowns when socializing as a noblewoman. It was originally released on a handheld device and if you want to play it on the PC or console that you play the rest of the Assassin’s Creed franchise on you need to buy it online at very specific places that weren’t marketed. (PS3) (X-Box 360) (PC)
- Left 4 Dead has Zoey and Rochelle are both attractive young women who possess the will and the skills to survive the zombie apocalypse.
- Nilin Cartier-Wells from Remember me is an attractive revolutionary – publishers not only freaked out about the idea of a female lead but also at the idea that the female lead might kiss a man. (Too much like men kissing men!)
- Borderlands 2 showcases women off all sorts and each possesses their own style and is equipped for their situation – be it adventuring, working as a mechanic or running a bar. (This game has sold over 10 million copies by the way, and been featured on BABD as a positive example)
- Casandra Pentaghast in Dragon Age certainly does not wear bikini armor or anything exploitative – but there’s no shortage of folks who find her incredibly attractive.
It’s actually not that difficult for creators to make female characters who are sexually attractive without going into bikini armor or other exploitative tropes. I mean, if you give a woman agency, ability and personality – odds are good people will find it sexy.
Essentially the problem is that the gaming industry, and many other mediums, are reluctant to take the risk of incorporating different perspectives and different priorities over “games to reassure straight white men that they’re straight and awesome”.
– wincenworks
Bringing this back this Thursday because the most important conversations to have in character design and critique thereof are not “is it sexy” or “what’s wrong with sex” but:
- What is the design really selling?
- Why should the audience be interested?
- How does it fit in with the other designs?
- How does it fit into media as a whole?
Unfortunately David Gaider has since removed his blog, but his rather excellent talk on sex and video games is still available in GDC Vault and still covers important points about perspective and privilege.
Even if you’re a soulless corporation making products purely for profit and only interested in sales – it’s worth it to consider all these points. After all, you do want your audience to like your product and to cut through the noise of what everyone else is doing.
– wincenworks