Guy that (supposedly) worked on a mobile game said they’d first tried not to use sex appeal. Tried some inoffensive DLC & got lukewarm response. Then they caved & tried selling things that “sexed up” the game. Supposedly they gained more male gamers (& their revenue) than they lost from girls leaving. QUESTION: Are there good visual examples of warrior women that are genuinely sexy (to teens into girls, theoretically) without being demeaning? Can we have “sex appeal” revenue w.out offensiveness?

The problem with crediting “sexing up” the game with increase in sales is that it assumes sex was the only avenue of generating interest – a theory that doesn’t hold up when you consider that some of the biggest selling game types (flight simulators, first person shooters, side scrolling platformers) often don’t include any sexual angle at all.

Back in 1970, Marvel comics experimented with putting Conan the Barbarian in comic format.  After the first few issues sales began to decline and the writer, Roy Thomas (who loved Conan), went to Stan Lee (who was indifferent to Conan) for advice.  Stan looked at the covers and the sales, and told them to shift away from putting animals on the covers and instead use more humanoid monsters.

They followed Stan’s advice: Sales went up again and the comic continued for twenty-three years.  However you don’t see many people campaigning that “Humanoid monsters sell!“ then trying to fit them into all marketing regardless of product or target market.  (And sex obviously wasn’t selling Conan, they had bikini damsels after all)

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Conan the Barbarian, in his loincloth and flexing his muscles, looked like a poor man’s Tarzan (which had been the popular comic fifty years ago) when battling animals – but when battling humanoid monsters he looked like a more mature fantasy narrative that was new and unique in comics at the time.

The only narrative that sexing/male gazing up a game really provides is “This game is made to cater to the fantasy of straight men.” So if swapping out your old narrative for this one increases interest and sales dramatically – then your old narrative must have been pretty boring.

There have been numerous warrior women in video games over the years.  Most of them have been under marketed, relegated to sidelines, ignored or otherwise mishandled due to general fear that they weren’t meeting the “make straight men feel important” factor that modern markets cling to as their sacred idol.

It’s actually not that difficult for creators to make female characters who are sexually attractive without going into bikini armor or other exploitative tropes.  I mean, if you give a woman agency, ability and personality – odds are good people will find it sexy.

Essentially the problem is that the gaming industry, and many other mediums, are reluctant to take the risk of incorporating different perspectives and different priorities over “games to reassure straight white men that they’re straight and awesome”.

– wincenworks

karniz replied to your post “have you seen the armor for characters on Diablo III, and if so, what’s your opinion on them?

Why do you guys just look at concept/promo art and not actual in-game armors? The actual armor within DIII is very well designed and not as sexualized as the samples you show. I feel it’s a disservice to your viewers that you don’t do more research..

Oh wow, you’re telling me that the promotional material Blizzard creates to market Diablo 3 are completely misleading and non-representative of the game… and not only has nobody mentioned this before but somehow it’s my fault?

Wow, I better look into that right away. Thankfully there’s always YouTube to provide us with Let’s Play videos so I can take screenshots that look slightly off since the live footage is always in motion and was never intended for still frames!

I bet the the in game models look completely different.  I bet they’re huge and so detailed that you’d be a fool to look at anything but what the actual in game play looks like.  It’d be ridiculous to propose that Diablo figures are displayed, by default, so tiny that you can’t make out any real detail beyond basic colours and silhouette right!?

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Oh… well never mind! The first thing you do when you start one of these games is create a character.  Obviously the Barbarian models in character creation will be completely different to those used in promotion and the ones that someone made gifs (from gameplay) of!

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Oh wow… what a co-incidence!  Oh well, there’s always the Demon Hunter right?  It’d be ridiculous to think that they’d use that stupid stance where she poses one leg in front of the other, sacrificing her balance to flaunt her hips! Or have her arms posed to both look like a she’s trying to be an action movie star and draw attention to her boobs.  That’d never…

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Wait a minute… does this game actually have all the problems previous suggested? Is it possible I just use promotional art and cleaned up gifs because they are easier to read and communicates clearer?

Is it possible that this kind of rampant double standard and objectification of women is so common in gaming that many people just assume it’s justified and normal?  And that it’s long overdue people called it out and didn’t just forgive games because there were a few good examples in it if you looked?  Or even games where it’s mostly good with some outrageously bad items used in marketing?

Outrageous! Someone should start a blog about this kind of thing… they could even like, make some sort of checkbox game to help illustrate the point!

– wincenworks

have you seen the armor for characters on Diablo III, and if so, what’s your opinion on them? i think they’re actually very practical compared to other games and if a piece of armor’s revealing on a woman it’s likely to also be revealing on its male equivalent :)

I don’t think I would ever describe any outfit from Diablo III as “practical”.  Which is okay in itself, fantasy that conforms strictly to reality isn’t much of a fantasy.

That said, I feel there is only one outfit for a character in Diablo III that deserves celebrating – the Crusader.  And I suspect she only got her outfit because of the moral implications of her occupation:

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All the others may be equally revealing, but are designed with very different stories and themes to them.  For example, as is appropriate to our blog, Barbarians.

First there’s the male barbarian. A massively muscular individual on a huge skeletal frame – his heart exposed due to his apparent unwillingness to match a breastplate with his oversized pauldrons and horned belt.

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Female barbarian, equally exposed per se but her frame is less bulky, her pauldrons less over done, she has no big horns before her and her outfit is structured to ensure nothing obscures the silhouette of her boobs:

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And of course, there’s the desktop wallpaper that’s seems to be a homage to Red Sonja in wardrobe, hair and general presentation.

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A lack of armor or even clothing is not inherently a bad thing.  It is not by accident that a totally nude warrior will not score Bingo, but a suit of battle lingerie will.  Depending on your circumstances, it may even be safer and healthier to disrobe before battle.

Outfits should not be measured by some sort of skin quota – there are some amazingly terrible outfits that cover a lot of skin.  Rather it has to do with the purpose and priorities behind the designs, no amount of tweaking a male version’s armor or arbitrary coverage rules is ever going to disguise when a design prioritized being sexy over being badass.  Rather it tends to just make things even more absurd:

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All of this is sadly pretty standard for fantasy and video games in general due to the strange belief that (regardless of what other aspects they have) at least the highly visible, if not all, female characters must present aspects like cleavage in order to be successful.

Which is really ridiculous when you remember that some of them (coughUbisoftcough) really seem irrationally adverse to including playable female characters in the first place.

– wincenworks

..my move is just awful, it’s chauvinist! Every time I fall over my vagina and vulva is exposed. I might as well be an NPC that doesn’t know where to wander!

Felicia Day, playing as Tyris Flare in the original Golden Axe game, (x)

Golden Axe, the iconic side-scrolling hack’em up is also a pretty iconic example of bikini armor:

And yes, Dolph LundgrenAx Battler (that is his actual name!) is wearing a bikini too but as well as being a male power fantasy (or someone I’d expect to see featured at videogamesmademegay) he always looks badass posed like Conan the Barbarian or a classical mythological figure.  He also quickly got an unsuccessful spinoff game and you had the option to play a dwarf who at least kept his shirt on.

Tyris on the other hand, despite having a much less ridiculous name, had to wait until 2008 when she would get to be the star.  But hey, that’s like eighteen/nineteen years of social and artistic progress right?  Let’s see how they portrayed her and promoted the game!

Yeah…

– wincenworks